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hey guys, I urgently need some explanation for the sub pattern on this match (118313847)

On the game, I set up my best player (by far) Nan (43234562) to be a Backup & Reserve on the SG position, with the starter Song being his normal backup. The instruction was set to "follow depth chart". A screen shot of the whole setup can be seen at
https://postimg.cc/qtBzCPPL


How on earth does Nan not get ANY minutes until 1 minutes left the the 3rd period? he got 5 more minutes in the fourth after my starting C (!!!) fouled out or otherwise he was a total DNP throughout the game.

Please BB review this part of the substitution pattern and tell me how am I supposed to be managing player minutes. It's already maddening enough that with a high stamina, Nan doesn't want to get subbed out (when Nan starts and Song has the backup & reserve spot, Nan almost always gets 40+ minutes unless it's a blowout), if the minutes are getting all screwed when the stronger player subs, I seriously don't know how am I supposed to manage the minutes with both the short roster requirement and gameshape minutes requirement anymore

Last edited by Bigeasy at 03/05/2022 07:55:03

I might still be in the shock of a one point loss against one of the major league competitors, but given that I'm in a serious BBM playoff and CBSL league champion push (with eyes on a B3 birth next season) after saving up for multiple seasons, if the current engine start to refuse allowing my best player to get into the game in a predictable and reasonable way, I really don't know how I can express my frustration in a more appropriate way

again, to clarify my problems with the current new engine changes:

I have a very dominant older player (Nan) with high stamina (ST = 9). As the current game engine goes, it seems that he either gets 40+ minutes if he starts, or he gets 1 minute if he backup & reserve (because his sub is also high stamina with all the team ST training I invested). Thus, this is not leaving me of any viable way to manage his minutes to satisfy the longer roster push as well as the weekly gameshape minutes requirement.

If the engine gives me an option to set Nan for 32-35 minutes for gametime, I would gladly do it - but currently, the updated engine is making one of the best players in the whole BB game totally unusable and unmaintainable

ya, that's something I'll try to experiment next - the problem with let coach decide though, is that

1. IIRC, it kills training, which I spent over 10m on my three trainees in the last couple of seasons with the assumption that I could continue to train them as long as I manage my minutes carefully, and

2. IIRC, the coach aren't really brilliant in subbing players with switched defensive assignment, which my team is highly dependent of.

I certainly hope we will have a reasonable solution to the subbing algorithms without having to throw my arm in the air and just wondering what the coach feels like on that particular day, with that particular matchup

Yes, after engine changes substitution works with many unlogic approaches. I also raised a thread, but no BB answered...
So bad imnplemented...

I'm a bit disappointed that after almost two days, no BB has commented on this thread yet - I can understand that there could be debates and considerations about whether this needs to be fixed and how it's best fixed and a final solution could potentially take more time than I am begging for here, but I really think this is a situation where BB should at least confirm whether they consider this a legit bug and are considering the ramifications about the changes.

Again, currently I don't see a reasonable way to maintain Nan's minutes and gameshape (He either gets 85+ min a week if he starts 2 games, or gets 55- min a week if he starts 1 game and sub 2 games), and without a legit means to maintain my old star player's GS, I'm basically throwing away a season I planed 10+ seasons for.

I honestly think this is a situation that the BB at least owe me a "sorry, we missed this specific situation in our change, we are discussing about how to approach this, let's keep in touch" note.

I appreciate the response and the discussion above. I understand that sometimes it's hard to find a flawless solution to a problem, and am willing to adapt to new equilibriums from new game rules/engine, etc.

at the same time, I do sincerely ask the BB that - whatever you are trying to achieve, provide a viable means to allow all managers to achieve it (ie. if we want a longer roster with more sub minutes, enable a system where we can actually get the subs into the game with a deepened roster)

personally, I really would like to suggest BB look into ways to combine the three similar-but-currently-independent concept into one:

A) The generally expected minutes played in a reasonably close game for a starter
B) The optimal time expected for a player to maintain a good game shape
C) The generally "effective time" a player enjoys on court before he is too exhausted

personally, I really think we could solve A LOT OF the current complaints if we could somehow set a relationship between these three - for example, B = 2 * A (the optimal gameshape time is what you would expect to start the said player twice a week, given his stamina), and C = A*1.1 (a player that normally is expected to play 36 minutes as a starter gets exhausted after 40 minutes starts to shy away from defensive/offensive assignments - I understand we already have the concept of decreased performance with longer time in the Game Engine, so the decrease of efficiency really shouldn't be too hard to implement, just a matter of finding the right penalty coefficient).

We all know it's hard to change the GE given how old and complicated it is. but if that's the case, at least we could make the GE as untouched as possible, and model our other concepts such as minute management & player efficiency according to the GE, right?