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U21 National Team Debate Thread (thread closed)

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From: Nick

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293077.3 in reply to 293077.2
Date: 4/10/2018 10:58:33 PM
From: Nick

This Post:
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293077.6 in reply to 293077.5
Date: 4/11/2018 9:49:33 AM
Desert Eagles
IV.13
Overall Posts Rated:
147147
Second Team:
Eagle Farm
I believe we had the talent to win, however Spain did play almost perfect tactics against us. They successfully double gdped our LI tactic. Personally, I would’ve ran LI earlier in the season, because I believe we were a little overconfident in that tactic. We only ran LI twice this season, both times against Spain. Playing it in an earlier match, against Nigeria or China, would allow us to gather data and compare to other offenses in order to determine our truly best offense. Also we got unlucky in the last round with some unfortunate GS on our guards, which is just the luck of the draw. Not much you can change there. As for our defense, personally I wasn’t a big fan of the 3-2 knowing that they would go inside. We were trying to disrupt their flow and passing, but they were just too good at that, and that came back to bite us.

So to recap I would try to run more of variety of offenses and not take any particular offense for granted. Also a higher variety of offenses could help throw opposing teams off of our scent, making it harder to hone in on a double gdp guess. And I would think more carefully about running a 3-2 when we are certain the other team will go inside. But in the end, hats off to Spain for an almost perfect tactical decision.

Oh and I would bench Julius Saunders

Last edited by Nick at 4/11/2018 9:50:35 AM

This Post:
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293077.8 in reply to 293077.7
Date: 4/11/2018 11:05:10 AM
Desert Eagles
IV.13
Overall Posts Rated:
147147
Second Team:
Eagle Farm
Teemo raises a good point here that I forgot to mention regarding the 3-2. The SB on our bigs was too low to be fully effective. Although that cannot be fixed for that game, it can be something that is fixed in the future. SB as a whole tends to be overlooked in my experience. Not every big needs to have it, but if a team wants to effectively run a zone, it is a must. In the future I will help train a wider variety of players, including a big with SB to help us be an overall team. We get a lot of guards with just 1v1F, OD, and PA. We get a lot of donkey bigs with high IS/ID and medium REB with little SB. We have a lot of players that do the same thing, with little variety. I believe that with a more versatile team, with a variety of player builds, USA can once again return to its former glory. This is a goal I have in mind that will shape the future. While looking at the past IS useful for gaining knowledge... it is time to focus on the future of this nation, and build a stronger base for our eventual dynasty.

This Post:
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293077.11 in reply to 293077.7
Date: 4/12/2018 9:15:41 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
120120
When I candidated 2 seasons ago, I emphasized the need of versatility of the team. So I would have played more outside attacks during the season, even if it would have meant more risks of defeat during the group phases.

Concerning the final, there are two main problems for USA :

- first the pace GDP of Spain : while having an average OD and a big flow from USA, it ended in 11 passes for 13 TO. That is an awful ratio for a LI. Versatility should be able to block these double GDP.

- 3-2 zone defense with inside GDP : there I will disagree with GM-Nick. This was not a bad choice according to me. USA OD was very high and Spain flow very low. But they had 26 passes for 11 to. Something doesn't feel right here. I don't know if we can attribute this to random generated numbers but it may have been an important factor. However seeing the players on sale right now, I would also say that you don't have enough SB on your inside players to benefit enough from this 3-2 zone specifity.


As one of the rare advocates of SB:
What level is your “recommendation” for bigs, SFs, and Gs, for effective zone usage?

Side note: what are your same thing considering passing levels per position group?

Obviously you work with what you get, but what would you find ideal?

@Nick. I ask you as well.

This Post:
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293077.12 in reply to 293077.11
Date: 4/12/2018 9:23:33 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
120120
From last season’s Silver medal team:
Both of you have mentioned about tactical and lineup choices.

Would either of you be willing to expand on specific games and specific lineup differences you would have done for either tactical or player utilization reasons?

We’re there players you felt were over utilized? Under utilized?

This Post:
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293077.13 in reply to 293077.9
Date: 4/12/2018 11:12:49 AM
Desert Eagles
IV.13
Overall Posts Rated:
147147
Second Team:
Eagle Farm
Nick, I hate you.

Aw I love you too

In response to JK:

I admire the amount of time and effort JKalltheway put into the position, and he did a great job as the leader of our team. Its hard to pick anything he did wrong, because he also did a lot of things right. But if i have to...

The first game of the season Jk makes a minor roster move that sets us down in enthusiasm, and we pick up one of our two losses on the season. While in the end essentially meaningless, since he fixed it and won every other game save the finals, its easy to overlook this mistake. If I become the U21 coach, I will keep my skinny fingers as far away from the drop players button as I can unless I need to.

The only other thing he did, as well as most of his supporting staff, was assume our strengths. He assumed that our LI would be untouchable, and that our Bigs were much better than Spain's. However, they were actually quite comparable, and due to a double gap, Spain was able to pull out the win. I would run Li a little earlier in the tournament so that we could compare all of our offenses and ensure which is our best, rather than assume.

But as I said above, I have the utmost respect for Jkalltheway and the commitment he gave to this team.

As I said in my speech, I think my biggest strength is my experience as a USA scout, my connections with the rest of the U21 staff, and my desire to form a personal connection with the managers with U21 aspirations, and all managers in general.

While Teemo has served as a scout for his french teams, the French U21 team may have different scouting procedures and training plans than the USA U21. Being involved with the program for the last few years, I already know our system and the way we typically train our players. There will be only a slight bump in our change of leadership, but knowing what I'm walking into will help ensure the smoothest transition possible.

Unlike Teemo, I have worked with the current U21 staff for many seasons. I know who likes to scout and train which types of players. I know who likes to help with tactics. I already have a connection with the staff, whereas Teemo would be a newcomer, and he would have to learn the scouts and the system. I believe my connection with our current staff will allow me to pick up right where JK left, and work towards returning to Gold status.

Over my years as a manager trying to train a player before I was involved in scouting, I was always frustrated by the slow bb-mail responses from scouts or coaches. While I now understand that scouts and coaches are VERY busy, I still consider it a priority to respond to the people as quickly as possible. I believe that I have the strongest desire to build our U21 and USA community of all the candidates, and it is this desire that will help america's talent pool increasing. A greater amount of training will only increase our success.

As far as our staff goes... we have a very good one. We have a few NBBA managers, and some ex-NBBA managers that help with tactics, which is very helpful, in addition to ex-u21 coaches such as JKalltheway that will help the new coach learn the ropes and all of the fundamentals of running the team. I plan on picking up an extra scouting class in order to relieve some stress off of our scouts, as I believe this is one of my strengths, and I will talk with the staff we have available on discord before every game regarding tactics, ensuring activity, involvement, and the best possible tactics. Our wonderful staff has always been our strength, and I know they will continue to be for many seasons.

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