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Playing against 5 centers

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232731.15 in reply to 232731.14
Date: 12/10/2012 1:51:34 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
66
Yeah I was just wondering about a little on FCP but I pretty much decided to go 2-3. BBall champ he doesn't have guards, they are all big men. I actually thought I didn't need advice on offense but I did. I think I am going to run PTB. Its up tempo like BBall champ suggested and it isn't dominate in one area and I need some inside and some outside.

From: GM-hrudey

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232731.17 in reply to 232731.16
Date: 12/10/2012 2:11:17 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
32293229
You dont need some inside and some outside. You only need easy points and to exploit weaknesses of your opponent. So many teams only play what their team is best for and totally forget to analyze their opponent and what will be the best way to beat them.
I'm not saying you should do this or that. You will win with a 2-3 zone, but you will win by more if you play a 3-2 zone.


So you're saying that if you're facing someone who does only one thing well, it's not a sound strategy to weaken the rest of your team to try to do that one thing not quite as well as your opponent? You know that BB users are a fairly conservative lot and this type of radical thought might not be well received! ;)

This Post:
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232731.18 in reply to 232731.15
Date: 12/10/2012 2:14:31 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
211211
so it seems to me that you have pretty much made up your mind to use 2-3 against your opponent but i just want to quote a few lines from the BB guide written by RiP
Since the implementation of the new game engine a new school of thought that has arose is that the 2-3 zone is far less effective than it used to be in the old game engine. Advocates of this theory maintain that against an inside team it is now far more effective to use a 3-2 zone in order to prevent the opposing teams’ guards from getting the ball into their post players. The logic behind this is that with the new GE putting a stronger emphasis on passing it is much easier to stop the opposing team’s guards (which probably didn’t receive enough passing training under the old GE) from finding their big men in the post.

just give spare some time to read it.

This Post:
00
232731.19 in reply to 232731.16
Date: 12/10/2012 4:43:28 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
66
So now you have me thinking even more. With a 3-2 would you not have a decrease iń rebounds?

I sorta of get what you are saying about offensive. But I don't think it's a good policy to run an offense that is your weakest. Outside is definetly weak for me.
2-3 Zone: Increased inside defense and rebounding at the expense of a lot of perimeter defense. Somewhat slow pace. (From Rules) It is generally regarded as the best defense to use against an inside offense but will be a huge problem should your opponent decide to use an outside based offense.
Best Against: Look Inside, Low Post
Worst Against: Run and Gun, Motion

3-2 Zone: Gives an increase in perimeter defense at the expense of interior defense. Slow Pace. (From Rules)
Best Against: Run and Gun, Motion
Worst Against: Look Inside, Low Post


Also would PTB give me more quality shots then R&G against a 2-3 zone?

This Post:
00
232731.20 in reply to 232731.19
Date: 12/10/2012 5:03:23 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
32293229
So now you have me thinking even more. With a 3-2 would you not have a decrease iń rebounds?

I sorta of get what you are saying about offensive. But I don't think it's a good policy to run an offense that is your weakest. Outside is definetly weak for me.
2-3 Zone: Increased inside defense and rebounding at the expense of a lot of perimeter defense. Somewhat slow pace. (From Rules) It is generally regarded as the best defense to use against an inside offense but will be a huge problem should your opponent decide to use an outside based offense.
Best Against: Look Inside, Low Post
Worst Against: Run and Gun, Motion

3-2 Zone: Gives an increase in perimeter defense at the expense of interior defense. Slow Pace. (From Rules)
Best Against: Run and Gun, Motion
Worst Against: Look Inside, Low Post


Also would PTB give me more quality shots then R&G against a 2-3 zone?


3-2 doesn't have a decrease in rebounds necessarily, no. It doesn't get a boost as 2-3 does, and if you have a good rebounding SF the result may be a net decrease since you pull him away from the basket, but there's no established penalty for RB specifically from 3-2.

The easiest way to think about your offensive dilemma: do you have better outside shooting than bots? Because he gave up 33% from behind the arc in his Cup game to a bot team. He's given up a high percentage from outside every game this season. There's a reason for this: he's putting up extremely low OD ratings and (for IV) extremely high ID ratings. You don't need to have lights out shooters to abuse a 2-3 defense, especially one that's all big men.

While doing something your team isn't ideally constructed for isn't always the optimal play, you have to remember that this is a game of matchups and your opponent matters. If you have an opponent that packs the paint with big men, all you need to do is have your guys pop midrange jumpers all night long. There's no point in trying to chisel through a wall with a rusty spoon when it's so easy to go over it!

Personally, I'd aim for one of the slower offenses too. When you're going against a team that can't defend you from outside but will have a huge edge on the boards, it's much better to take longer to get a high quality shot and reduce the chances that you miss and almost certainly concede a rebound. I think that as much as the midrange focus would be a reason to strongly consider Motion over R&G or PTB.

The best thing I can do for you is this: using the advanced stats from the USA Offsite (I think you're a member), you can see that your opponent is giving up 18% shooting on contested inside shots, 27% on drives, 27% on jumpers and 37% on threes. Yes, you read that right, the highest shooting percentage he gives up is from beyond the arc - and that's without the bonus to outside shooting that comes from playing an outside based offense. If you want to put on a helmet and send your guys to run into his interior wall, or try to build a wall yourself with overmatched players on defense, feel free, but the smart play here is to go over his wall and to make sure he can't get past your perimeter when he has the ball. Motion and either 3-2 or M2M is definitely the way to go.

This Post:
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232731.21 in reply to 232731.20
Date: 12/10/2012 6:59:22 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
66
As I am shooting .385 (15-39) behind the arc while playig LI I believe I can shoot fairly well especially knowing he gives up 37%. The thing is about the defense is that I do have good rebounding sf and as a team am a good rebounder (51 RPG) just not to the extent as 5 big men. Here is the defense for my starting five. PG OD 10 ID 5, SG OD 11 ID 4, SF OD 8 ID 8, PF OD 5 ID 11, C OD 3 ID 13
Also something to consider:
PG JS 11 JR 6 SG JS 11 JR 7 SF JS 10 JR 6 IS 9 PF JS 5 JR 6 IS 12 C JS 3 JR 2 IS 13.

From: MPL

This Post:
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232731.22 in reply to 232731.21
Date: 12/10/2012 8:02:07 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
4545
Is this "playing 5 big man" an american thing or something? I don't get it.

From: PaulWooton

To: MPL
This Post:
00
232731.23 in reply to 232731.22
Date: 12/10/2012 8:22:35 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
66
No it's a not very smart manager thing. Btw I don't have have 5 big men I am playing a guy with 5 big men. My guess is they do it because they are cheaper and in D.V they promoted with it so they didn't care.

This Post:
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232731.25 in reply to 232731.24
Date: 12/11/2012 11:03:08 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
66
I never said I wanted to run inside. In fact in my first post I said I knew I wasn't doing that.

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