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U21 National Team Debate Thread (thread closed)

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From: Orko27

To: FurY
This Post:
11
296456.134 in reply to 296456.132
Date: 10/26/2018 11:54:27 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
4747
1) The US u21 prospects will fall to a variety of managers as many of you whom have filled the role of scout or u21 manager have done in the past. This isn't something that is very fixable, it is just something that has to be managable in my view as a former u21 manager. What approach do you take as the u21 manager, and what approach do you delegate to scouts, when it comes to multiple different types of owners? I won't qualify a response for my vote if you answer with something about how you are going to get those owners to commit more to your strategy by being more active. And yes, i am voting and have not yet decided.

Many prospects are best suited to following a fairly straightforward and established routine of training in order to maximize their chances of being useful to the U21 squad. For these cases, I would rely on the group of U21 scouts to provide an outline for those who need it and to return with the results of their communication with these managers. If there are managers with unusual ideas or prospects that require specialized builds to have a chance at success, I will do my best to offer my honest advice on a case-by-case basis. The same goes for any particularly promising prospects.

I do not expect to be able to make anybody follow advice or training plans. I will give suggestions for targets, as well as plans for reaching them. If a manager decides to go a different way, I will work with them as best I can to see if we can come up with something that works both them and the team. If not, I'll wish them the best, make myself available for future advice, and move on to focus more compatible prospects.

2) The US u21 team in general is typically somewhere between 3rd and 5th best in terms of total primary ratings it can achieve compared to the rest of the worlds group. 3rd falls in line with the population for the US in comparison to other countries, and 5th falls in line with probably where we stand in terms of having interest in our national team. Therefore, the minimum expectations is that a semi's birth occurs from the u21 efforts each season (whether or not it is fair for that given season). What measure do the u21 managers have in place for improving the performance we had last season to the point where we can get that result at minimum again.

I understand the expectation that the team should be competitive each season and will do my best to evaluate the specific strengths and weaknesses of each talent pool on it's own merits in order to come up with the best suited strategy as we go. Given the sometimes...mercurial nature of GS management and injuries in this game, I expect that there will be a fair number of wrenches thrown into the works throughout any season, and I believe that I am good at adapting to available resources on the fly. I'll plan for a best case scenario, while trying to have a viable backup plan in mind each week.

3) Do you believe in primary-oriented players or do you believe in secondaries? I don't plan on deciding on voting based on the response to this, just kinda wanted a feel for what the tipping point was mentally.

I think that it's pretty much always true that more secondaries is always preferable, but I can't remember ever seeing a talent pool that had the luxury of ignoring primary-oriented players on a regular basis. Given the limited amount of time available to train U21 players, there's only so much secondary training you can do without leaving primaries below a usable level. So, assuming similar primary levels, I'd certainly give preference to the player with better secondaries, but I don't expect to have the luxury of extreme pickiness.

From: khenry

To: FurY
This Post:
00
296456.135 in reply to 296456.132
Date: 10/27/2018 10:17:19 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
487487
1. We have a variety of very knowledgeable scouts and folks involved with the U21 that are spending each season training for the team. U21 manager gives the blueprint for how he wants the team, specifically with the 21s or even 20s on the team. But for 18s and 19s that’s the pipeline and why we have a talented staff and scouts and a head scout. The biggest thing we can do is educate managers on the benefits of training and what are the best practices and plans for it that we’ve learned. This not only makes our team better, but creates a stronger domestic base as a whole.

2. The expectations are simply part of the job for USA managers. We need to first make sure we make the finals in Americas to avoid the Repe and set ourselves up a little easier for Worlds. Then the task is simply navigating the field and managing GS(hopefully folks have a Sports Psycologist). Easier said than done, but our pipeline is still working at a high rate and I have no doubt the next manager will have all the tools in place to make a run at Gold.

3. Nobody is ever going to be against secondaries, but at the end of the day you only have so much time to train for the U21. If the difference on a big is 1 less ID but 5 more OD, then the secondary defense plays in his favor, but like I said if there’s no option but having a donkey then that’s what it is. Secondaries can absolutely come into play when deciding between a couple players though.

Good luck in Canada!

I once had a team with 1757 players and was $25,835,360 in debt. This is not that team. Join the Discord group open to anyone, but especially for USA managers to improve your club or get involved with the U21 and NT programs (https://discord.gg/cKpNkt2).
This Post:
22
296456.136 in reply to 296456.3
Date: 10/27/2018 11:07:04 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
120120
A question:
I was trying to see any and all information to decide why I should vote for you or consider you. SO, I went into your most recent seasons' team draft history. As, Scouting in mostly bot filled leagues, finding talented young players, and drafting them, either to develop or sell, is not too different than u21 scouting.

(46297790)
(46297804) understandably cut
(46297792) understandably cut
(43936945)
(43936938) 2 days after you drafted him, he was purchased from free agency.
(43936975)
(44737247) Kept. but not trained. In player history, you can actually see his salary has gone down since you drafted him.
(44737248)
(44737242)
(45517643) At the very least could have sold
(45517667) At the very least, MVP potential, WOULD have sold.
(45517681) Understandably cut

You seem to always cut your draftees. Some which have promise. I can only look at this, and see, since some could have been sold for money easily, as clear sabotage. Why are you wasting everyone's time running for u21, when you are SEEMINGLY sabotaging young usa prospects intentionally?
(296455.2) From your speech " I have always been focus on player development"
This seems contrary to your drafting and training history.

Last edited by RandyMoss at 10/27/2018 11:11:09 AM

This Post:
00
296456.137 in reply to 296456.136
Date: 10/27/2018 11:15:36 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
9595
Because I am COMPETING, look at your notes it is not time to train American players but only for American Under 21 team. It has been that way for many seasons. I am not looking for profit right now. I am about to have to make a new team and if I don't get out this season I am rotating draftees in division III and or division IV. Which is why your ahead of me at this current moment because I have been dedicated to helping the under 21 staff and fixing the pipeline and we are almost their.

I have a list of non current scouts that needs to be on the team and I want to fix the roster. If I can get the scouts and then the discord Guaranteed Gold in Americas. Probably high ranking in Worlds and yes we will indeed pass the Frenchies.

From: WardoYT
This Post:
00
296456.138 in reply to 296456.137
Date: 10/27/2018 11:21:49 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
9595
In a normal everyday COMPETING lineup you would've banked on Europeans players being profitable. You know why we have had this problem why don't you ask Lambini who hijacked all the Americans player pool because every1 was trying to fix the pipeline.

Message deleted
This Post:
00
296456.140 in reply to 296456.137
Date: 10/27/2018 11:25:01 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
120120
Because I am COMPETING, look at your notes it is not time to train American players but only for American Under 21 team. It has been that way for many seasons. I am not looking for profit right now. I am about to have to make a new team and if I don't get out this season I am rotating draftees in division III and or division IV. Which is why your ahead of me at this current moment because I have been dedicated to helping the under 21 staff and fixing the pipeline and we are almost their.

Its been since Season like... 36, since I saw you on anything with scouting....

Your team making the finals in back to back years and losing is something I can (recently even) relate to. I actually found the way to get over the hump for my team personally, was more to do with training, than buying rosters that had static player skill sets. before this winning of the finals, I had made the playoffs all 4 seasons in a row prior to it (so 5 playoffs in a row), with 1 finals appearance and loss too. all my purchases never did anything. Where as the training and development helped push me past the others.

^ I will take this, and translate it to a u21 question for you. Would you ber using all of the roster right away to clal up all the *best* players, or would you save spots tactically, and monitor the trainings and such, because someone might out-train, or come along better than someone else, and be a better player later in the tournament?


I have a list of non current scouts that needs to be on the team and I want to fix the roster. If I can get the scouts and then the discord Guaranteed Gold in Americas. Probably high ranking in Worlds and yes we will indeed pass the Frenchies.

fixing pipelines....
How are they broken? 3 seasons, is awfully quick for things to break. Its either "done" or "not done". Also, it looks bad when you use a xenophobic slur like "frenchies". If you are going to represent U21 as its coach. I'd advise against making seemingly racist comments.

This Post:
00
296456.141 in reply to 296456.140
Date: 10/27/2018 11:34:28 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
9595
I been here since 09 and you were one of the very few I ever connected too because why?

With my team I plan on filling spots full of draftees and training them up SLOWLY. I haven't transfer out any players because I am waiting on the pipeline to fix itself so we can become very profitable and possible become a world power house again for the next 10 seasons if every1 who has been fixing the pipeline stays with the pipeline and that is the current plan.

Broken because people didn't want to work with the Under 21 staff and or went off the haywired with their training plans and have been so for all of their Managing career on here.

Last edited by WardoYT at 10/27/2018 12:24:07 PM

This Post:
00
296456.142 in reply to 296456.141
Date: 10/27/2018 11:39:08 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
120120
SO...
let me get this 100% clear...

to fix a pipeline that is broken, and missing talent....

you have been firing Superstar, and MVP potential players.... rather than selling them to people who MIGHT train them... to fix the pipeline... and the shortage of players....

What?

This Post:
00
296456.143 in reply to 296456.142
Date: 10/27/2018 11:41:55 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
9595
I have always trained the MVP pot trainees and selling the Superstar and starters. Where have I fired in any of my teams and MVP European player that is of age to train? Greensboro Generals have never been my team. That 27 year old is capped and didn't need to be trained.

This Post:
00
296456.144 in reply to 296456.142
Date: 10/27/2018 11:44:55 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
9595
Yes you are correct that I haven't been active but been active in training players and selling them for value and helping the Under 21 staff when I can. I believe I have been using time to my advantage since season 36 on this game. Also if you take down your notes it implies that real life happen and real life happens all the time for every1.

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