BuzzerBeater Forums

BB USA > U21 National Team Debate Thread

U21 National Team Debate Thread (thread closed)

Set priority
Show messages by
From: Nick

This Post:
00
296456.104 in reply to 296456.103
Date: 10/25/2018 10:32:27 PM
Desert Eagles
IV.13
Overall Posts Rated:
147147
Second Team:
Eagle Farm
Hey all,

Despite a thousand angry americans with (very sharp) pitchforks sending me to the gallows, they are allowing me a few last words. With these I'd like to say a few things to american voters.

1. I'm sorry I let you all down. There were games like Italy where I made great decisions... but there were many more where I made poor decisions. With the roster we had i didn't expect to win, but I should have at least made the semi's. I failed in my tactical duties, and thats all I can really say. Whats done is done, we need to move on to bigger and better things.

2. Antwon gets my vote here. He was easily one of the most active voices in U21 discussion last season. Aside from Randymoss, Antwon was my other main advisor, who I often sought out for advice on tactics, even before I mentioned them to the whole group. I trust Antwon as much as anyone on BB, and he'd be a great manager. While khenry bailed on his discord and scouting duties without notice, Antwon stepped up and took over some extra players to account for it. He has been one of the most active managers for the U21 team in the last couple of seasons, and I can't think of anyone else better for the job.

3. I understand when real life hits and you get busy. I experienced that myself as a u21 coach. However, what khenry did was only poor form due to the lack of notice. He just up and left with no message whatsoever to the rest of us. He's a great manager, and what he transformed the Nipponese team into was as close as you can get to a miracle... but he has lost my trust as a potential U21 coach.

4. While Orko did train one of our bigs for last season, and was responsive to the bb-mails I sent him, not once in my U21 term did I see him offer advice or suggestions on a U21 game regarding tactics or roster lineups. Clearly he knows how to train as he homegrew a USA NT player, and he knows tactics as a member of the 100-win club in the NBBA. However, I'm not comfortable handing off the reins to someone who hasnt participated in U21 aside from just training a player and answering bb-mails.

5. I believe in actions speak louder than words... and the only one who has SHOWN me these past two seasons that they care about the U21 is Antwon. I will of course support whoever wins, and teach them anything they might need to know. I will still train for the team, and help scout (if the coach wants me too) regardless of the elected. However, I think USA should vote for Antwon. He's proved to be the most dedicated of the candidates, and in my eyes is the best man for the job.

Farewell to all, for it is my time to pay for my crimes against the country. It has been nice knowing you all, and... dammit JK, stop poking me with that pitchfork im almost done!. As I was saying...

The crowd hushes as the lever is pulled by a member of the crowd. The women cry, the children scream, the men bow their heads. It is the end of an era.

Rest in peace GM-Nick


Last edited by Nick at 10/25/2018 10:37:53 PM

From: Holocron

To: Nick
This Post:
44
296456.105 in reply to 296456.104
Date: 10/25/2018 11:15:38 PM
U.K Nuggets
III.16
Overall Posts Rated:
6666
Second Team:
U.K Nuggets II
I’m just here so I won’t get fined.

Smallfries and Randy already asked the in depth questions. Now back to what everyone has been harping on. Time commitment. How will all the candidates fare with time committed to the U21 for the next 6 months? Khenry I know you’ve answered for the next couple months what about for the Worlds season? Gpolin what about you and being able to talk tactics/lineups/scouting and all from a whole different time zone? Antwon what about you and schooling? Look what happened this last season when school got in the way.

@Nick So basically what you are saying is Antwon had a big hand in a very horrendous season so why would we want to elect someone who had a hand in that?

Also we peg A-Dub for promoting Sahand but did the Medium Dark Cabal not back Nick as well and where did that get us?

Late Edit: To all candidates: How will you choose your roster? We had a couple instances were players made the roster but got sold and were kept in pitiful GS until the games didn’t matter. How will you combat these situations? Will you take an American owned player and manager over an American player but foreign owned even if he isn’t as good? By as good I’m talking a 1-3TSP difference. You can choose what SPs one has over the other to answer this.

I’m really just here to play devil’s advocate.

Last edited by Holocron at 10/25/2018 11:30:19 PM

This Post:
00
296456.107 in reply to 296456.26
Date: 10/26/2018 2:34:35 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
4747
1. Being the head scout, you will have to work closely with me (or fire me, remove me, whatever!) as well as the rest of the staff/USA U21 community. While not being explicitly stated, many managers want to be involved in the decision making when it comes to tactics and rostering even if the Head Coach does not agree. How do you plan on dealing with these expectations?

If someone presents a persuasive argument that goes against my plans, I'm always willing to be convinced. I've made plenty of mistakes in my BB career and am more than happy to be given the opportunity to avoid my next one!

That said, at the end of the day, somebody has to make decisions and take responsibility for the results. I expect to take the blame if things go wrong, so I will reserve the final decision-making for myself.

2. There are many other duties that are involved with being a U21/NT coach outside of setting a lineup. There are database duties that only the Head Coach can do, and the job itself is a six month commitment. It does require a level of maturity and dedication that will require you to go a bit above and beyond. USA managers quite literally are putting a year of their lives in training time in your hands. Do you understand the scope/responsibilities that are required of you?

There's a reason why I never ran in the past!

I'm aware of the level of commitment involved and wanted to wait until I was sure that I had the time and energy available to dedicate to the task. I'm there now, and plan to lean on the advice of those who have been there before me.

3. How do you make an omelette?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-Wr401Bio4

From: Orko27

To: Mixx
This Post:
00
296456.108 in reply to 296456.27
Date: 10/26/2018 2:40:46 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
4747
@Candidates - Where would you balance your preference of lineups/tactical decisions with input from special interests like the Offsite or the Unofficial Discord (aka 'Medium Dark' Cabal)? Particularly in games of consequence.


I've got a similar response here to what I said above: I am always open to input from qualified sources, and I believe that I still have plenty to learn about the best way to play this game, but I believe that the responsibility for the team ultimately lies with the coach, and as Spiderman didn't say, "With great responsibility, come great power."

If the pitchforks will be coming for me when things go wrong, I'll want to be the one who makes the final decisions.

This Post:
00
296456.109 in reply to 296456.53
Date: 10/26/2018 2:56:38 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
4747
Here's one for ya. What is more easily achieved, a strong defensive build or a strong offensive build. And which is more valuable in a u21 setting.

The way that skills and elasticity relate certainly make it easier to build a strong offensive player. In terms of individual players, the value of each is dependent on the strengths of the rest of the roster, but scarcity generally equates to value in this scenario.

From: Orko27

To: Mixx
This Post:
00
296456.110 in reply to 296456.57
Date: 10/26/2018 3:04:42 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
4747
@Candidates - With the advent of the Youth Trainer skill point targets will increase. How do you approach standardizing the addition of the secondary staff? The cost can be signficant, especially to the lower division managers. The benefits are also not well known as the data appears to still be accumulating.

I haven't seen enough actual data to make firm recommendations on the matter, but I would ask anybody who is rostering a top prospect to strongly consider picking up the best YT that they can maintain. Once we have a few seasons of real data to look at, it will be easier to make factual arguments. In the meantime, it boils down to not wanting to take the risk of stunting the growth of top prospects during their most efficient training seasons.

This Post:
00
296456.111 in reply to 296456.66
Date: 10/26/2018 3:13:29 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
4747
My question for orko: if you are elected will you use discord more often to communicate with everyone or some other medium?

I would definitely use the Discord more than I have in the past. While I vastly prefer a discussion platform that includes the option for threaded discussions, I also believe that you go where the audience is. It would be absurdly inefficient and egotistical for me to try and force everyone onto a discussion board when there's an established communication infrastructure already in place.

From: Orko27

To: Phyr
This Post:
00
296456.112 in reply to 296456.79
Date: 10/26/2018 3:24:30 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
4747
Everyone: Can you give examples of USA U21 or NT players that you have trained in the past. If you have not trained any, what qualifies you to guide a long term training program for dozens of players.

U21: Chris Prater, Eli Gay, Aubrey Bliss, Gerald Carrasco

NT: Aubrey Bliss

And I am currently working on Nelson Melendez for the U21 and Kim Fortin for the NT.

From: Nick

This Post:
00
296456.113 in reply to 296456.112
Date: 10/26/2018 3:26:54 AM
Desert Eagles
IV.13
Overall Posts Rated:
147147
Second Team:
Eagle Farm
So would you say you're partly biased to run because you have an upcoming potential U21 player?

From: Orko27

This Post:
00
296456.114 in reply to 296456.105
Date: 10/26/2018 3:44:56 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
4747
Late Edit: To all candidates: How will you choose your roster? We had a couple instances were players made the roster but got sold and were kept in pitiful GS until the games didn’t matter. How will you combat these situations? Will you take an American owned player and manager over an American player but foreign owned even if he isn’t as good? By as good I’m talking a 1-3TSP difference. You can choose what SPs one has over the other to answer this.

Obviously, the first step would be narrowing options based on skills. Once that is done, I would heavily favor players from managers who have shown good communication during the development of their player, as well as those who have demonstrated an understanding of GS management.

I would not assume that a US manager would be more likely to maintain GS and/or follow training suggestions than a foreign manager. I strongly believe that most people can be counted on to do what they believe is in their best interest, so I would base my decisions on what I know of what those managers want to accomplish. There are likely a good percentage of people who would do it for 'Merica, because that's what they value, but I wouldn't assume it as a default.

Advertisement